Hey nerds, I'm Wil Wheaton, and this is "The Ready Room,"
your official behind-the-scenes hub
for all things Star Trek Universe.
Today, we'll be diving headlong
into Season 3, Episode 4 of Star Trek: Discovery,
"Forget Me Not."
And like a Trill symbiont and its host,
the spoilers and I are one.
So, if you haven't watched Season 3, Episode 4 yet,
you definitely wanna go check that out before you watch us.
And you're not gonna wanna miss what we have in store
for you this week, because we have
another two-on-one interview coming your way.
I am joined today by the good doctor,
and the good astromycologist,
Wilson Cruz and Anthony Rapp are here,
to talk about the latest with Culber and Stamets.
Then, a little later, we have a new exclusive clip
from next week's episode of Star Trek: Discovery.
Of course, this latest episode gave us
some incredible insights into Star Trek's newest characters,
Adira and Gray, along with brand new lore
surrounding the Trill.
For more on that, we go to this week's
"Moments of Discovery."
Control room, engage.
We go to Trill in an effort to see if the individuals
on Trill can help Adira get their memory back.
Speak your names.
Um, Adira.
Continue.
That's it, that's my name, Adira.
There's never been a successful joining
of a symbiont and a human.
So, here's this human who has the symbiont,
and everything's working out fine, there's no problem,
it's just that Adira can't remember where it came from.
She's unable to access the memories of her symbiont.
They know that something is trying to come out,
something needs to be said.
So, Burnham takes them to Trill, to the Caves of Mak'ala.
The sacred Caves of Mak'ala.
The traditional caves where the symbionts reside.
The Caves of Mak'ala. It somehow, some way,
may be in there, Adira can get their memories back.
In there is a pool, which hosts other symbionts,
but they think that this is possibly the only way
that I'll be able to connect further with the symbiont.
[Sonequa] And you believe that Adira's symbiont
will be able to communicate with her here.
It's their ancestral home.
If not here, then where?
Our team here built the entire cave by itself,
and then the pool as well, which was
this murky, white, fairytale-looking water.
We had Special Effects build us a raised platform,
so, at any point, the cast could stand up on the platform,
and not have to worry about treading water.
We had a bunch of rigs attached, we had harnesses.
We had Costume put a handle, that I could grab onto,
onto the back of their costume.
So, he would be under the water while we were filming,
and laying back, and kind of floating on top.
I held my breath, swam to the bottom of the pool,
hung onto the weights stack, hung on to the actor.
I would get a verbal cue underwater
that I could hear through a speaker.
He would wait, give us a few seconds,
and then just tap right before, he had a rope,
and would just pull us down.
[water splashing]
The actor knew that on the third tap,
I would pull underwater.
I'm gonna go "1001, 1002, 1003, 1004, 1005."
It was really scary, but really, really fun.
Sonequa: That's it. -: Yeah.
Sonequa: Perfect. -: Fine, we could go longer,
as well.
Sonequa: Exactly! Right? -: Yeah, it's not, it's not--
Sonequa: It's so easy. -: Not bad at all.
[Sonequa] It's so much easier than I thought
it was gonna be.
So, it really, really felt like we were in there.
It was the coolest thing I've ever done.
It actually worked out very, very well.
What's happening?
I don't know.
I've never seen anything like this.
[Adira gasps]
When Adira comes out of that experience,
they have reconnected with the symbiont inside,
reconnected with all of those memories,
and, because of that, is able to give us the location
for Federation headquarters,
and that sets up where we're gonna go in Episode 5.
I am now joined by the two wonderful men
who bring Dr. Hugh Culber and Paul Stamets to life
on Star Trek: Discovery, Wilson Cruz and Anthony Rapp.
Thank you so much for taking some time to talk
with me today.
It's super awesome to see both of you.
Same to you, man.
Well, Wilson was even a bigger Next Gen fan
than I was before we did the show,
and then I became one after I got cast,
so, we're both geeking out, too.
Also, we get to talk to you, so, thank you.
Yes, yes, absolutely, we're big fans, thank you.
-: Nice to be here with you. -: That's so totally cool.
All right, let's start with
the two of you being back together again!
In Season 3!
Oh, I cannot tell you how hard it was for me,
to watch these two men who love each other so much,
be torn apart, and then to struggle
through trying to come back together.
And after everything they went through last season,
there is still so much turmoil in this new future.
It is such a relief to see that these two men
are at least communicating again.
[Anthony laughs]
And do you feel like they're able to see eye to eye?
We're very early in the season,
I imagine this will play out.
This is an arc that's gonna take a little bit of time,
but would you guys just talk a little bit
about where your characters are right now,
and how you, as actors, got them there?
Well, I mean, I'm in the coma
at the beginning of the season, or comatose-ish,
or induced coma. And I do believe
that the presence of Culber, of Hugh being there,
in that moment, does penetrate.
But I think it's still, Stamets wakes up,
and you're like, this is real?
We really are here and you're really here?
Yeah, I think that alone, the fact that he stayed,
that Hugh stayed, it doesn't need to go
through a lot of extra resolution beyond that,
because that is such a statement in and of itself.
That's such a being-- I am here, I made this choice.
The letting go was really difficult.
The double letting go, almost like a triple letting go?
-: Yeah. -: Was really hard, but when he comes back,
I think it doesn't need to be,
now I don't need you to prove it.
That's the proof.
You stuck around, you stayed,
you left everything else behind.
In their own way, I think they have this back and forth
about them.
They kind of nudge each other, and poke each other a bit,
and I think that's our way, in a way, of making love.
It's kind of how we show each other we love each other.
And
I think we do that in the first few moments
we have together.
I think there's such a deep connection there
that we know that we're back in a good place.
The love that these two characters have for each other
is one of the great Star Trek loves stories.
Just seeing how much they deeply care for and accept
one another, and are there for one another,
is really inspiring to me.
I really felt that a lot of Season 2 was,
if you took and made of a broad view of the season,
that it's very much about sacrifice.
What will we give up for each other?
And, here, at the beginning of Season 3,
I feel like we are experiencing a little bit, from the crew,
the consequences of that sacrifice,
and that need to make a connection with each other.
So, the characters all feel like,
okay, the sacrifice was worth it.
This is scary, we're a thousand years in the future,
and we don't know where, we barely know when we are.
[Anthony] Yup.
And the crew, as a whole, is not doing very well,
emotionally, as a result of that.
So, in this episode that we just watched,
we got to see
some really intense conflict on Star Trek.
Which, surprisingly, is not very common on Star Trek.
My Star Trek, we had a rule:
"There's no conflict among the bridge crew.
We're all on the same page."
[Anthony] Right.
There is this amazing, beautiful,
uncomfortable dinner scene that Saru puts together,
and brings everyone together.
And we get to see you guys as a family,
at this family dinner.
Who hasn't been at a family dinner like that?
But at one point during that dinner,
it just blows up,
and we know it's coming.
And it feels awful, but we know it's gonna be there.
Would you both talk a little bit about the emotional state
of the crew, and how your characters relate
to the crew's emotional state,
as you're getting specifically to that moment?
Which just feels like such an important moment
in the development of these characters
and their relationships.
Well, I think one of the things
that our writers have done such a beautiful job
is giving us inner lives and things to really dig into.
And, yeah, we're all on duty, we all have our jobs
that we do, but not neglecting the fact
that we're all people, and people going through something
as profound as letting everything you know behind
is going to have effects.
You can still be really good at your job,
you can still be professional, but inevitably,
there's gonna be jagged edges that come out.
So, it felt very satisfying to us
that we were given that opportunity to explore that.
And then, the manner in which it is explored
feels very authentic and real.
So, it felt very, very satisfying to get to do that scene.
So, as that emotional turmoil is beginning
to express itself, as that emotional turmoil is beginning
to get worked out,
I am aware of Culber taking on
some mental health responsibilities for the crew.
And what I saw-- and I could be projecting--
but what I see is maybe the foundation of, Starfleet
in the 24th century, putting a counselor on the ship.
Do you feel like he's going to perform that function
for the crew?
Yeah, I do.
I mean, you, the actor, know the answer,
cause you filmed the entire season.
I am asking you, from more of a fan perspective,
do you feel like, yeah, this is something that,
this feels right, this feels good,
this is helpful for me and them.
Do you feel like that's kind of where he's at?
Yeah, I think it feels earned
and I think it feels necessary.
And I think it presents a lot of opportunities for me,
as an actor, but also for the show,
to deal with those kinds of issues.
So, yeah, I think it's exciting for Dr. Culber
to bring those two things together.
That the physical and the mental,
we look at a person's health holistically,
and that that is the way of the future.
Let's switch gears a little bit.
On a lighter note, Stamets and Culber have both taken
an interest in the ship's newest crew member, Adira.
For Stamets specifically, do you think he sees a little bit
of himself in this other brilliant engineer?
Yeah. [laughs]
And could that possibly be why the two characters
hit it off right away?
Yeah, I think that Adira comes on
like this blaze of confidence, this child.
To Stamets, Adira is a child.
How old are you, 17?
16.
Would you please remove your 16-year-old fingers
from my life's work?
What did I just say?
This is an interface of some kind.
Okay, we get it, you're smart, everybody here is smart.
But comes on knowing what's going on
and figuring it out.
And while there's irritation at the chaos that's ensuing,
there's also immediate admiration.
So, yeah, it's an unusual thing to see Stamets soften
as quickly as he does, but what Stamets has always done
is responded to excellence, responded to skill.
Yes.
Responded to people who demonstrate
that they are worthy of being there.
So, Adira clearly knows what's up.
And so, that is immediately something
that draws him to Adira.
And then, Stamets has shown himself to be willing
to be a mentor, I mean, certainly to Tilly.
Yeah.
So, it's not so out of the realm of likelihood.
But, yeah, there's something especially special about Adira,
including the fact that Adira is also a little flinty.
There's a phrase that our new cast member, David Ajala,
likes saying, "Iron forges iron."
-: Yes. -: It's a form of that.
Yes.
They kind of go clash, but with respect.
Yes.
Yeah, so, it's immediate.
And then, one of my very favorite things
about this whole season is what continues to evolve
between Stamets and Adira,
and then, also, Hugh and Stamets and Adira.
It's one of the best things I've gotten the chance to do,
of all three seasons.
I, too, am very excited about what's about to transpire.
One of the brilliant additions to the cast
is amazing actor and comedian Tig Notaro, and, Jett Reno,
wow, what a perfectly drawn character, just--
What a great name, too, right?
What a great name for a character. [laughs]
Right?
Jett Reno sounds like, could have been written in 1928
as a pulp hero.
-: Yeah. -: For sure.
And I love the relationships that both of your characters
have with Jett, but I particularly get so excited
when Stamets and Reno are in a scene together.
I would love it if both of you would talk a little bit
about working with Tig, and what she brings to the set.
Well, I mean, on a very personal level,
Tig was already somebody that I really admired,
and whose work I really enjoyed.
But, I lost my mom to cancer in 1997,
and the way that Tig talked about her experience with cancer
and her experience of losing her mom was so moving to me,
and I felt a very strong connection to her
before I ever met her.
And so, the people always say,
be careful of meeting your heroes.
Well, guess what?
Sometimes meeting your heroes can be a wonderful thing.
And Tig has been an incredible person to be around,
to share this experience with,
and she's just always a total delight.
One of the things that's most delightful about her is
that she doesn't think that she belongs there,
and she doesn't have any ego about it.
She's like, "What am I doing here?
I'm on a starship?
Sure, okay, yeah, I'm talking about engineering.
What? I don't care."
She's so free with it.
And she brings such a level of, there's no pressure on her.
So, when she's on set,
it just brings a lightness and joy,
and sense of play.
So, yeah, to play ball with her is the ultimate
in fun and pleasure.
Yeah, I don't even know how to top that.
I think what Tig brings
is a sense of spontaneity,
and you have to be on your toes. [laughs]
[Anthony laughs]
Yeah.
'Cause anything could come out of her mouth.
But it's always fun and we're always having a good time.
And the thing about the scenes with her is
there's always gonna be some element of,
it's always fresh and it's always light and fun,
but she can turn it on you, too,
and it's very effective when she does.
So, I love being with her, period.
You said something about always being ready,
and Anthony, you talked about playing, right?
And I have an improv background, and a big part of that
is just playing catch.
Just "Yes, and...," just having fun,
knowing that we can all trust each other.
And, Wilson, I just flashed on this piece now.
I don't know if this makes the final cut of the show,
so this question might get cut from the episode, but,
there was a moment in the dinner scene
where you all are doing haiku.
And Hugh gets to the last line of the haiku
and blows it.
Is that a haiku?
Yes.
Emperor Georgiou, feasting on the finest cuts,
snarfs cookies on the down-low.
I screwed up the last line.
[actors laugh]
Even better, hear, hear!
Just, as an actor, it looked to me like Wilson, the actor,
went, "Ah, man, I screwed that up."
But in the context of it, it feels real.
It feels like a very real moment.
I almost got there and I blew it,
and I can hear someone off-camera laugh.
Which, makes me think--
'cause I saw a rough cut, so, it makes me think,
was that a real moment from the set
that was inspired by that?
Or was that actually in the script
and you are just such an amazing actor,
I completely believed it?
Oh, buddy.
Yeah, it's the latter.
Oh, wow.
[Wilson laughs]
-: It's the latter. -: Wow, wow!
I, 100%, thought that was a real moment.
Amazing, sir.
Well, can I say that--
First of all, thank you, that's very sweet of you to say.
And, yes, those are all their words.
They wrote everything and I just say the words.
But I think what's important about that moment?
Yes?
I realized, actually, as I was acting it, is,
there's no reason to believe that Hugh Culber doesn't know
how to create a haiku.
Of course.
What he's doing in that moment is giving people permission
to make a mistake.
Oh, of course.
Because, if you can make a mistake, you can be vulnerable.
Yeah.
And I think that's what Dr. Culber is asking of people
to be at this dinner.
That's why the dinner was a good idea,
because there's a way to get that information out.
So, Dr. Culber, in that moment, is like,
"I can be perfect and create this beautiful haiku,
or I can show you that I, too, am fallible,
which gives you permission to be fallible and vulnerable."
That is such a beautiful choice.
That's wonderful.
Star Trek has always been super groundbreaking
in terms of representation.
I think that's really important, and I love that a lot.
And the announcement that Star Trek was introducing
non-binary and transgender characters in Discovery
Season 3, continues that groundbreaking tradition.
The two of you broke incredible ground on Star Trek,
being an openly gay couple, and that is so important,
so wonderful. And I'm wondering what it means,
to you specifically, as groundbreaking members of Star Trek,
to be working on a show with more characters
who are breaking more ground on Star Trek?
Early on, we were talking, actually, Wilson and I,
at some point, I don't remember exactly when
but we were like, "How and when
will we have trans representation on the show?"
It's seemed like
-: it's inevitable. -: Season one,
we were talking about that.
And it has to happen, yeah.
But, so, in the future, how will that be addressed,
and what will the dynamics around it be?
So, it's really just exciting, on that level,
to see what's come of it.
But the most exciting thing about it is that there is,
among the most exciting things about it, for me personally,
are that, these two actors that they've cast,
Blu del Barrio and Ian Alexander,
they're not just wonderful actors,
but they are such a demonstration to me of the future,
that we're gonna be standing on the shoulders
-: of the young people, right now. -: Yeah
Especially the young people in the LGBTQ community.
If you go and follow Ian's Instagram and Twitter,
and what he is saying and sharing with the world
about his experience, is so incredibly brave, beautiful.
But, also, just being around him, and I think this is true
of so many of the young members of the LGBTQ community,
it's like, there's no other way to be.
It's so evident that he is ready for this moment,
and he and Blu are ready for this moment to be.
And there's not just, they're gonna be like,
"Yeah, I'm a role model." They just are themselves so fully,
and unapologetically.
So that infuses their performances,
and infuses the way that their characters come across.
But, as much as anything else, the way that they're going
to be representatives of their
sectors of this community
are really, really, really inspiring to the whole.
Yeah, I mean,
you know Anthony and I have been out actors
for all of our careers.
Yeah.
So, we come to this knowing
just how resonant
this is going to be for millions of people.
I spoke to Alex, I sent him a little email,
Alex Kurtzman, after the announcement was made.
And I just wanted him to realize that,
by just putting these two characters on the show,
just their visibility alone,
the power of that act, of putting them on the show,
and making them centered, their story centered,
is going to save millions of people's lives.
Young people are going to decide
that they actually understand what it is
that they've been confused about for all of these years.
They're finally going to have a name, and a word,
and a definition for their own feelings.
And that alone will save millions of people's lives.
So, I produced an entire documentary
about the power of visibility,
and how it changes people's perspectives,
and how it changes our culture.
I think this, if I had made this documentary
in two more years, these two characters
would have been central to that story.
Because, when we put
the most marginalized people
in our society in the center of our stories,
and we shed a light on them, we free millions of people
to feel and own their own stories.
And, so, that's what's happening with these two characters,
and I couldn't be more proud to be a part of a series
that is as committed to their stories as Discovery is.
Let's wrap up where we started.
I told you how much I love Paul and Hugh,
I think they're amazing.
And I'm just crazy about your portrayal of each of them
and the relationship that they share.
And, just as an admirer of your work,
it's been such a pleasure to speak with both of you.
I am honored to share Star Trek with you.
-: Thank you so much. -: I'm honored to share it
with you.
We stand on your shoulders.
We stand on all your shoulders.
-: Amen. -: Oh, thank you so much.
Thank you, that means a lot to me.
Now, this season, we've already seen some really cool stuff
from Star Trek: Discovery's design team,
and today, we have an inside look
at a few of the new outfits this season,
from Discovery's own Costume Designer Gersha Phillips.
Check it out.
So, these two costumes are what we see in Episode 301.
This is our Burnham costume, and this is a new character
that we're introducing, who gets introduced in 301,
called Cleveland Booker, or "Book."
We first meet him on a planet where Burnham has just crashed
into his ship, so she's wearing just her under suit,
which is under here.
Cover that uniform. Try to look normal.
This piece was one from his closet, say,
of his collection of things that he had.
So we sort of combined, we sort of used elements,
of what we did for his costume, and put it into this costume
for Burnham.
Sized it down just a teeny weeny bit,
so it wasn't too oversized on her,
although Sonequa really loved the idea
of being swamped in this costume.
We've advanced into the future.
So, we tried to use technology, and things like that,
that felt more futuristic.
Although Book's planet is a little bit more organic,
so some of his pieces had a little bit more of that feeling,
that they were not as slick and techie,
they were more natural and organic-feeling.
So that's why we went for the mesh shirt underneath,
and the layers.
And the leather itself, even,
is like a three-tier treatment.
We do a paint treatment, then they foil it on top,
and do all this really great stuff to it
that makes it look like that.
So, it has those layers to it, and that depth,
which is really fabulous.
These are Burnham's courier outfits.
The same idea that, like how we created Book's costume,
is that, things that she found, bartered for,
and maybe they're a little bit more alien.
'Cause this is something that we use
for a Cardassian costume that we did
at the Mercantile Exchange.
So, we pulled bits of that.
We actually made a vest, a leather vest,
and pulled this off of a coat, and added it on,
and it's really cool, I kind of love it.
It has a really cool,
futuristic, apocalyptic, alien look.
And then, this was another beat that we did that's similar,
again, for that courier beat.
We did about five or six costumes, different little beats,
when we see her on her ship and things like that.
We distressed the leather
and added some interesting components to that one, as well.
And, also, this one we put wire in the collar,
which is another thing that I really liked doing.
Just to give it a little bit of personality,
you can mold it into what you want it to be.
The Earth Defense were like the first uniforms we did
for this season.
The attempt was to make something futuristic, different,
and push forward with the look.
I also wanted it to have a piece of an armor element.
The idea of this, that it would turn
into a full attack vest.
If we went further with these characters,
we would create that--
do that sort of thing where it just expands
into something more, more coverage and more safety.
So, this is the basis of it.
So, we molded this piece.
We 3D printed it, actually, first,
and then we made a mold of it here.
And then we covered it with this mesh.
And then this is the piece that goes over top.
So, it was a three-layered piece, like that.
So that you can get into it, we put a snap here.
[Velcro tearing apart]
Velcroes off and you zip the zap jacket like that.
Which was an interesting journey, for us to figure that out.
'Cause I didn't wanna do the full vest-type thing,
I wanted it to look different
and have this idea of suspending it this way.
I am Captain Ndoye of the United Earth Defense Force.
Leave immediately, you are not welcome here.
She was the leader of the Earth Defense.
We wanted her to have this different uniform.
So, instead of giving her the chest plate,
this would be the same piece,
but hers would do the same thing that that would be,
ideally, it would go on and protect her in whatever way
that was necessary.
And then, adding these little collar bars,
and things like that, different ways of showing,
how to show higher ranks, etc.
And that's her.
May your search be fruitful, Captain Saru.
Next week, the U.S.S. Discovery and her crew will attempt
to reunite with their long-lost Federation.
And I think I speak for all of us
when I say I cannot wait to see what they find.
As always, we have an exclusive sneak peek
at what's to come in Episode 5, "Die Trying."
Oof, that is a rough title.
Okay, check it out.
[Saru] Captain's log, supplemental.
After a journey of 930 years,
and a return to Earth that we could not have anticipated,
we are finally on the verge of reaching our destination,
Federation and Starfleet headquarters.
Separate entities that must now abide together.
A sign of this new time, I suppose.
I can only hope that they are as eager for us to arrive
as we are to be home.
Captain?
Number One?
[Burnham chuckles]
Every report, record, and log that you asked for
is ready to be handed over to Starfleet.
Words aren't enough, are they?
930 years.
I trust that what matters most will have endured.
I know that there will be protocol,
I know that we'll have a lot of questions about the Burn,
but there are other things that I'd like to inquire about,
as well.
You are thinking about your mother.
Yes, sir.
And I know that I'm lucky to have someone to hope for.
I believe that, here, there are answers for you,
and solace for all of us.
I really hope so, sir.
Thank you all so much for joining me here
in "The Ready Room" today, to talk about the latest episode
of Star Trek: Discovery.
I will be back in one week
to discuss Season 3, Episode 5 of the series,
which I can already tell you,
without getting into too much trouble,
is going to have some very cool reveals.
All right, I've said too much.
Until then, I'm Wil Wheaton.
Live long and prosper.